If you want a single action trigger pull, either carry a SAO autoloader in condition one, or choose a hammer fired model that one can manipulate its condition at will. The stone cold killer blows a hole in the braggarts forehead and his buddies stand there with their jaws agape while he starts shooting them. Barrel: 4.5. One of the interesting things about that is I can (after clearing) dry fire repeatedly and get a rough visual about how much the aim point moves depending on my grip and finger position. My wife carries her Beretta 92 loaded with the hammer down and the safety off so all she has to do is draw and fire; first shot DA and the rest SA. Fat troll. 1 you many not have time to chamber. Prices accurate at time of writing. Is really shouldnt be that hard. If anybody could advise me, I'd be grateful. I know some people , maybe most people , will be just fine carrying a Glock with a loaded chamber , but all the reasons people give for not are not 100% wrong either . But people *MODIFY* (for chrissake) their Glocks trying to make the trigger compete with a 1911, then wonder why they shot their foot off. Question: If it lands on its muzzle could it not go out-of-battery? If one wishes to carry sans a round in the chamber. However, there still isnt a compelling reason to carry a gun or keeping one for home defense that isnt loaded which cant be gotten around with a bit of training, a bit of brains, or a bit of extra gear. Someone with little firearms experience who feels over confident in his/her carry technique is more likely to find him/herself in trouble. Your local police do exactly that. 30 years carrying, 20 in the military with 6 combat deployments. Fuck off gov. More bad advice, did the author not learn from his first mistake? The answer is "yes." Milliseconds count. The Glock 19 is one of the most popular models of Glock that is available on the market. There are no Glock negligent discharges *without* the word *negligent* in the incident description. No external safey, DA trigger that goes bang when you pull it.. Didnt fire..interesting. The gunfight at the end was pretty good otherwise, but at one point Costner gets 16 shots out of his Colt SAA without reloading. If you forget to check the chamber just one time in you life its Sayounara . He grew up hunting, fishing, and trapping. The chamber under the hammer of any carried revolver is *irrelevant* for the first shot, since cocking the hammer of an SA or pulling the trigger on a DA advances the next chamber to the firing position. One common question among Glock owners is whether or not they can shoot aluminum cased ammunition in their . Alright so you said all the pros, not all are valid. As a matter of fact in an extreme emergency you could carry the HK with no holster and in your pocket or even waist band but if you did the same thing with a Glock you would quickly blow your balls off in short order. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. After all people driving cars kill more people than people holding firearms. Subscribe and receive the latest information on GLOCK products and more. What is the I.33 for humidor and candle or Grndtliche Beschreibung der Kunst des Fechtens for bananas?;-). Please note, comments must be approved before they are published. Carrying a single-action pistol cocked-and-locked is far and away the best method of carry. It worked before. I carry "Mexican" and don't want to end up like Plaxico Burress. Again, though, training is the answer. If you cant respect the power and danger of an automobile why would you think you could be trusted with a firearm at all let alone one without a safety? No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Certified Glock Armorer, Colt Armorer, FN Armorer, Beretta Armorer, Smith and Wesson revolvers Armorer. . My Glock 23 is fully loaded, and no problems at all, even with the 3.5 connector in it that lightens the trigger pull a bit. 1) either way you do it it takes Training, 2) ya silly ass might forget to flip the safety an fire so there is you 3 seconds, 3) the bullet may not fire, in which case you have to chamber anyway. A GLOCK does not have an external manual safety. Kathy Jackson suggests that doing this safely comes down to two things, equipment and habits. Glocks are designed with internal safety features to prevent accidental discharge. Well, technically, you could also just not drop them I suppose. Thats when I started looking for a better way. I also felt the same way. and self styled know it alls. Want to vent about something? Even some shotguns will do that. Who honestly gives a F*ck what someone else chooses to do. Anything is possible, which is why the smart move is to play to the best probabilities. I have yet to find a dumb ass vaccine. Note, the sentry safe does have a security vulerablity that can be mitigated by covering a hole with stainless steel tape. There is an old article in the LA Times and National Intrest that claims Glocks are accident-prone and overly dangerous pistols. It completely wraps the pistol in hard plastic so there is no chance of anything flexing into the trigger guard. A un-chambered carry gun is useless. Your taste is in your ass., Your brains (what little you have) are in your ass. Apply the 21 foot rule. These arent exactly the most concealable guns out there. I know, its a big word, all scary long and has lots of syllables, but try it out. I have kids, but they have been taught that if it can go bang assume it will if the trigger is touched. Id rather they stop production than change a design thats gone on unchanged for as long as it has. Bottom line: For *any* firearm, you have to *put your finger (or some other object) INTO the trigger guard to fire the weapon.*. Pray the opponent was just carrying a Taser and not a knife. The Glock handgun is the preferred handgun of police worldwide. Those who defend not carrying a round in the chamber preach about it's safety. All that said, training, knowledge of your firearms design/function, and practice go a long way to make any firearm safe to carry with a round chambered though some designs are better for a particular purpose. Fairbairn and E.A. You carry your way and Ill carry mine. Maybe you should just use a spork. Learn what it means to have muscle memory. Second, they also trained. But in my house, in the middle of the night, what do I care about 50 yard accuracy or the ability to knock over a steel plate or knock a bowling pin off a table? Those stances, their great for cops and competition but IMO bot so great in a gunfight up close. Normally, empty chamber carry adds an average of maybe 2/10ths of a second. The claim is that because Glocks have no safety and a super light trigger, they accidentally shoot people. Whats the big deal? So, us non-glockentines keep a low pro on discussing polymers and plastics, but if I had to go to war tomorrow, you can it would be an all steel weapon. Situational risk assessment. You do what you gotta do or are allowed to do. The firearm entered Austrian military and police service by 1982 after becoming the top performer in reliability and safety tests.. Glock pistols have become the company's most profitable line of products, and have been supplied to . When she holstered her Glock .40 it went off and the bullet went down her leg utterly destroying it. Much the less wish to discuss the merits of hammer mounted versus frame mounted firing pins, or the S&W design of using a rebound slide instead (my favorite design). The Glock is a semi-automatic pistol that was originally designed by an Austrian manufacturer called Glock Ges.m.b.H in 1982. From someone that ignorant, nothing he says or does would surprise me. The Springfield Armory XD-E is a new hammer-fired compact pistol. While I believe training is the answer, its not just fingers that are the problem. An insignificant cretin crying for attention in a world that has left him far, far behind. My Ruger LCP is carried with one chambered, and in a pocket holster that covers the trigger. I think five guns is the bare minimum, and thats how I always answer the one gun question. For my "duty firearm", I carry a Glock Mod 22 Gen 4 (.40 S&W cal.). Personally, I have several, ranging from BP revolvers to modern SA and DA revolvers & semi-auto pistols, to rifles and shotguns. If you are so scared of a striker fired trigger, then why not get a hammer fired gun? Lets face cold hard facts the more chances you take the more likely you will run out of luck, usually much sooner than later. What is wrong with such ones is that they get a nice, warm, mushy, feeling of superiority over others by putting them down. Considering the capabilities of the average glock owner, in front of the muzzle is likely the safest place to be. Any striker fired pistol that doesnt incorporate some type of manual safety has the same chance of a ND as a Glock. If my shooting was up to par with my driving Id be like Lena Miculek. Also thank goodness I dont even have to make THAT choice. I recommend RTS Tactical for reliable, rifle-stopping options, Youre worth it. Introducing an unchambered firearm means you only have one hand, at best, firmly gripping the pistol. She had the edge, rock steady hands of a brain surgeon. Youll likely only be in one or two gunfights at most, in an entire lifetime. Never mind the others. I just grabbed a shirt from the laundry pile. Various firearms but could go to dagger, spear, sword and buckler, longsword, or smallsword if for some reason one of those seemed like a good idea. Ugggghhhhhh why are we still talking about this? That photo of the safe is cute, if completely patronizing to those who make the kids argument. Kaboom he shot himself as he sat there at the dinner table. The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. Stop buying Glocks. Someone who wants to spend a couple thou on a gun should be more than willing to put the energy into learning how to use it safely. Here's video that GLOCK produced that explains the trigger safety. Kids are grown, hoping dad doesnt ever need to move in, not the reverse lol, and I have em where I need em to be and they are ready when I am. Few indeed even care about SA revolvers anymore, or even know they exist, or care about the firing mechanism. They are: Glocks are completely drop-safe and are one of the safest pistols you can carry. Mr Hoober, If you werent too busy arrogantly doubling down, you might consider trying it some time instead of pretending you know everything but I suppose you are probably more interested in getting audience engagement than giving good advice. For those of you that don't know, "Israeli Carry" is the practice carrying a pistol without a round in the chamber. Go peddle your homosexual fantasies elsewhere. It became the norm to carry with an empty chamber. Mar 8, 2017 (Edited by Moderator) The LCP II is just as safe to carry as any striker-fired gun on the market without a thumb safety, including every Glock and most M&P's etc. I home carry, but as far as pistol lockboxes go, I recommend the Fort Knox (top opening lid) and the Sentry Safe with biometric lock (also has a key and keypad). I am lacking a rapier and main gauche though so maybe not ready for the six fingered man. But now I get 18! Somewhat different than in rural MS tho, speaking as one who attended a full auto shoot at a local range about a month ago. There are some days (summer, mostly) when I carry the Walther PK380. BTW.. Glocks have a 5.5lbs trigger pull so I doubt it will discharge from your love handle rubbing on it. I have pocket carried for years, mostly using a clip such as a clip draw on my SIG 938, hammer down, safety on, round chambered. Mine, of course, is in the latter, and it's held up well to a lot of shooting. Big Bill: Yup. The internal Safe Action System will not allow the pistol to go off accidentally. This also means that if the firing pin somehow gets enough inertia to hit the primer, from some other source than the hammer (whatever that source might be), and then the round in front of the pin suddenly ceases motion, the firing pin will continue forward into the round anyway, no matter what the hammer, trigger, barrel, or etc, do. I got them after watching the best experts I know of, champions, and their green light review. This subject is DOA just like the OP. If I have to carry a compact, its a DA only with no safety or one with the safety off. Even in that highly unlikely scenario, the gun would likely kill them anyway, even without going off, by blunt trauma alone. I am sure you will tell us that since you are a stable genius it will never happen to you. Descriptions: Glocks are safe to carry with a loaded chamber as long as they are carried in a decent holster that completely covers the trigger. I would like to carry at the ready, but doing so really gives me the heebie-jeebies. And, sorry youre a confused fool. We do all make mistakes. Picture if I was to just strike a primer laying on a hard surface, with a hand held hammer, manually. I will still carry unchambered. Ive done this quite a bit when rabbit hunting. For that matter, I dont take seriously anyone who carries a revolver for self-defense. A few weeks went by & I realized I was safe. 19th century Colt hammers. JavaScript is disabled. But still a nice catch. The 43 chambered for the 9x19 cartridge, along with its immediate predecessor the .380 caliber Model 42, were not the . To sum up: there were a few objections to my original post that, on their face, had some truth to them. Thank you very much. The fact remains, we are always training. I have no issue using any of my Glocks as a SD gun, nor do I have any issue using any of my 1911s, any of my revolvers, or any of my other guns. What kind of a moron thought THAT was a good idea? There is also one of an off duty cop pulling up his pants and firing his clip draw equipped pistol. There is no doubt about it. The 223/5.56 is the most common centerfire rifle cartridge in the US. Unlikely. I also like the guy getting thrown across the ally when he gets hit with both barrels of the shotgun through those 3/4 boards, but even better is when the same happens from a .45 Colt round. The problem is not with the Glock trigger, the problem is a lack of training on the part of the operator. Perhaps if someone drops their gun from two stories up and it lands muzzle down on somebodys head? Why would you do that more in a Glock than in *any other firearm*? It should stay the way it is. Agreed. One other one was very tragic. My G19 pull is about 4-1/2# about the same as a lot of 1911 guns. They said that it was the fault of Glocks having a super light trigger. I can cycle the bolt almost as fast as I can take the safety off, even when I stepped on a black bear who was sleeping under a downed tree. It has good stopping power and it only slightly has more recoil . Knowing how impossible that is, Im NOT one of those. Clinging to God and guns. When I go hunting, I carry my Remington 700, bolt action rifle with the striker discharged on an empty chamber. Modern handguns are designed to be carried with a loaded chamber. and yes i train and rehearse that . Bet you still get stabbed. Actually, I only did that for about ten minutes before retreating to a men's room, unchambering the round, and putting the gun back in its holster with a full mag but empty chamber. Or would it it take more movement of the slide to do that before an impact could trigger potential discharge? Agreement. People that just cant accept what someone else wants to do compared to what they feel is best for them smacks of their insecurity. But that would be true for almost ANY gun that didnt have a manual safety engaged. THAT is a significant, even dangerous, error to be stating as fact. Victoria: FNS9-C. You have to train how you'll fight and fight how you train. Its common for someone to quickly raise a gun and try to shoot, just to realize the safety was in the on position keeping it from working. For 1911s, the danger is similar if you carry hammer down on a loaded chamber though I dont know why any somewhat intelligent person would do so. Many revolvers also changed; whereas the firing pin was once integrated with the hammer . But do suggest they make more of them and lower the price for us plebes. And I include all the copy cat weapons as well as they are as common as the common cold. I carry one in the chamber of my ruger P89 with 17 rounds in the magazine. Marshals (1998). First much like the Israelis Fairbairn and Sykes had to teach officers how to carry safely in a manner that got them street-ready quickly. DA/SA make the most sense to me. While numbers vary, reacting to something - anything - takes a . You learned something. The Glock Gen 4 and Gen 5 models have actually ended up being popular with civilians and self-defense shooters alike. An unchambered gun is a dangerous, useless-to-you half measure. You can get a lockbox for $50 or less from Amazon or from most hardware stores. A 16 year old In drivers ed may not be very experienced nor skilled, but at least in my day, was paying more attention than a driver more familiar with driving. and you can have a hammer strap optioned for anything with a hammer except dao. 1 - 20 of 30 Posts. Some people were never meant to have a handgun I suppose. Glock firearms Instructor. I dont understand why anyone who carries a modern firearm is afraid to carry a round in the chamber??? In fact, Ill prove it. As for me on striker fired Im sure they are just as safe as any other design I just like to see whats going on, . Go. It's a small handgun that is easy to carry, chambered for a very powerful cartridge, and priced so a working man can easily afford it. Come on, Gov, you know better than that. its full screen with proper sound and everything. Of course all of those Glock NDs were due to human error. @ mark s: +1 here. But as Sam has pointed out, one needs to practice and I have. Perfect analogy. If youre going to do something like defend yourself with a firearm. . Usually for at least an hour or so. Didnt check that the gun was clear. Let's dive into the depths of insanity when it comes to concealed carry myths. Let the flaming begin, No flame. All are coded alike, but each has a different weapon in condition 1 ready to go. The Glock handgun is the favored handgun of police worldwide. (AgCatJHS at English Wikipedia [Public domain], via Wikimedia Commons)Here we have a conundrum. if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[250,250],'guntradition_com-leader-2','ezslot_6',115,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-guntradition_com-leader-2-0');All this comes from an old incident within the New York City Police Department. You can lift and close the bolt to cock the striker quicker than doing all four motions. I wouldnt have or carry any with a non hot pipe, but thats just me. Third, the reason that actual experts (I would say I am knowledgeable to a point, but an expert I am not) recommend NOT carrying in Condition Three is for the reason that it takes a lot of training and repetition to get truly proficient and most people with a lot of training and proficiency dont carry their pistol unloaded. If you cant train yourself to keep your finger off the trigger until you have made the decision to shoot any gun is dangerous in your hands. A Glock is a reputable brand name of pistols, and the weight of the trigger pull can mean the difference in between a firearm firing and not shooting. In meantime, happy to train Israeli carry and take the tragedy buffer. Belittle all you like, there is only one gun in my house which I will not keep around fully loaded, and that is my one Glock. How often do you train your driving abilities?. A admit, these days are different a 3 grand safe, that folks have to go look up the damn combo to, or wake up with a shadow looking at them in a dark bedroom and try to get to a box hopefully in reach without getting halfway up out of bed. Most 1911s come with a half cock safety, but again, you would have to ensure it was engaged properly and its prone to breakage. I lost a whitetail in heavy cover to the click when the safety is released. But, IF I were, then Id have to choose that DA revolver in my headboard. Carrying this way isn't for everybody though. The Glock take down system is an accident waiting to happen and happen it does all the time. I want something that goes bang when I pull the trigger, and I could care less how heavy or gritty that might be. or not. . And the latter is where a Glock is dangerous as is *any* other firearm. I felt a few of the points that were raised had enough merit to discuss further. Hmaag [CC BY-SA 3.0], via Wikimedia CommonsTodays revolvers have a flat hammer. So that argument is irrelevant. (I dont think any of us are going to try to pocket carry a 1911 or a Glock 17.). I couldve even been Ken again, like I was here years ago. Oh - And my Cobra .22 has one round in EACH chamber. This is why. Whatever stage you carry your weapon at be consistent. Two motions will always be quicker than four, unless one can somehow arrange to do all four simultaneously. if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[250,250],'guntradition_com-box-4','ezslot_7',110,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-guntradition_com-box-4-0');Some people are nervous about Glocks because they heard one rumor or another about them. He thinks. Probably applies to a few other westerns as well though. I carry a Glock 21 with a round in the chamber I constantly handle the gun to keep excellent muscle memory if you dont want to have the gun fire dont touch trigger. Too big, to heavy although I can cock the hammer on the draw with no problem (passive firing pin models). But no self-defense. The Sig 320 problem was that it had an internal block but dropping (or smacking it with a hammer) could make the trigger move to disengage the firing pin block. I have trained chambering on the draw and while it is less effective I am still way ahead of the guy who doesnt carry. With only six on tap anyway, whats one less? Of course, older designs without an internal firing pin block can go off if dropped. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. We keep our mouths shut, myob, and avoid praising glocks. Heres how all of this bogus started. I may not have the time to chamber a round if a BG is close enough. i doubt that israelis whose primary weapon is a pistol actually use israeli carry. The gun is DA/SA, so the first shot is a long pull on the trigger, but I routinely practice it, so Im OK with it. Ron DeSantis Says He Supports Adding Open Carry to Floridas Permitless Carry Bill, Defendant Agrees Appeals Court Should Uphold Injunction Blocking New Yorks Law Banning Carrying Guns in Sensitive Places, Judge Robert L. Miller: Its an Insult to the Founders to Assume They Didnt Expect Gun Control in Future Generations, https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/the-truth-about-6-5mm-ammo/, https://patents.google.com/patent/US5724759A/en, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p28yT3Z3oj8&t=7347s. Training happens every time we do something, no matter if its shooting, driving, or eating. Answer (1 of 104): For me. The safety either keeps the trigger from being pulled or blocks the cartridge from being struck by the firing pin so it cant go off. This is especially true when it comes to the popular Glock line of handguns. People that just cant accept what someone else wants to do compared to what they feel is best for them smacks of their insecurity.. Um, Smith & Wesson doesnt use a transfer bar, they use a hammer block. However, it is not unusual for some new to guns like Glocks to be concerned about carrying a round chambered. I carried it un-chambered for a few weeks till I was comfortable. That carries over to shooting, believe it or not. Boy, that must be realllll nice. Not the first time I have seen you feed the gun grabbers agenda either. Let the one with no traffic tickets throw the first stone. Seattle is like a miniature version from a driving perspective. Those who scream that everybody who doesnt think exactly like them, pick the same options as them, etc., are dumb for not recognizing that they are perfection itself, are just more of the loads of SJW types out for attention by putting everything and everybody down, to make themselves feel a bit better about not having a life. Muscle memory is a life saver when things go adrenaline slow MO mode, and those Taurus, PT-111s, have that thumb safety where Im used to one being, the pipe is red hot, and, eyeball to eyeball, it will fire again without re-racking the rear sights on someones nose. I ran a corner thru the trigger and around the other side up the grip. In a holster made for the gun you carry, making sure its unobstructed is a quick check. I will say this again: If other blogs can do it, then it can be done. link to What is a Pistol Caliber Carbine. The first Glock safety that you will interact with is the trigger safety, which takes the form of a spring-loaded lever located in the center of the trigger. You should always carry with a round chambered. People who dont carry with a round in the chamber have no training. Between the trigger safety, the firing pin safety and the drop safety I feel very comfortable carrying it chambered. And it will ALWAYS stay in its holster right? 2 you may forget to chamber silly? The Gen 5 Glock pistol is the latest generation in the Glock household. As stated above, Glocks are safe. Carry it in your home in the holster you're going to use in public, without a round in the chamber, but with the striker in the ready position or "cocked" and see if you have an issue with the trigger being pulled. It still works now, so long as the comment page is more than three years old. Risk vs benefit should ALWAYS be a part of this decision. I doubt it. Five years ago I reviewed the Glock 43, the second pistol in Glock's "Slimline" series of thin grip pistols. But my Glock has an empty chamber. Running this way I am even more vigilant about how I handle the gun. the number of people out there who keep a single-action revolver as a home defense. I was shown( Thank You RES), yank that sucker out, moveaim, fire. That chit will get you *illed in a real shtf. It comes down to your comfort, training and repetitive use. But, OFC, the current crop of TTAG writers are kept too busy chasing sponsors to look up the meaning and physics of the things theyre writing about. I have no worries about the gun going off when holstering it or even worse going off by itself while in the holster as many Glocks have done when a fold of the holster got snagged inside the trigger guard. So when do you get to be a klutz if youve taken the time to train those reactions until as the experts say you not only get it right, you cant get it wrong? Theoretically, the slide safety could be accidentally disengaged in your holster rendering a cocked and locked 1911 significantly more susceptible to a ND when drawn given the user didnt know the safety was disengaged. They make it look soooo easy in the movies! As long as you use some sort of holster that covers the trigger, and keep your finger out of the trigger area, leave the 19 in the holster, unless its needed, you wont have a problem. When carrying the gun in a holster, the grip safety will keep the gun from discharging, even if the . SOME of these guns (Ruger, Rough Rider, IWI, Freedom Arms, Linebaugh) have transfer bar safeties and thus can be carried fully loaded. Clearly not enough to train for scenarios where chambering a round can be life or death. As one gun writer said years ago, its amazing someone was not smart enough to hire a good gun savvy lawyer and sue Glock out of existence with all the accidents this pistol has caused. No kids at home anymore so no worry there. Its your right to self defense. If gravity provides the inertia instead of the firearm, then the problem wont arise unless the gun is moving towards the ground, and then stops. All of that seemed a bit verbose for a blog comment, though. They didnt know. So Move. 4 under extreme stress you may short stroke it. Dave: And the 1911 series 80 fits into that category. OMG I love those old Fractured Fairy Tales shows! My AR is half loaded with the mag in but unchambered. Ho Hum, Well written Its just not for me, especially as I get into my golden years. You can conceal the Glock 43 comfortably and discretely in a Galco leather holster like the . As for the replicas, these are hit-and-miss when it comes to carrying on an empty chamber. We can talk about home carry vs guns hidden in various locarions in the house. Its kind of unneeded though, because inertial firing pins can only build firing inertia on their own if the whole gun accelerates, and then stops suddenly. about carrying or keeping a gun with a round in the chamber. A lot of guns, particularly the early revolvers, were considered too dangerous to carry with a loaded chamber because a sharp bump or drop could cause it to fire.

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